Practising polyrhythms in Chopin?

Question

So um, I've recently started the first movement of Chopin's second concerto, and really I think I've lost the hang of the polyrhythms/vocal embellishments (haven't played them in ages). The odd tuplets in the right hand and the four quavers in the left, something like 19:4.
I can practise them slow so the notes are all precise, but I don't see how it will really help when I play fast. Do the embellishments really have to be precise with the left hand?

Answer 1

Your problem inadvertently demonstrates the futility of practising these matters slowly and then hope to get performance speeds by the mere expedient of 'speeding things up'. It will never work, for the simplest of reasons that the adaptive movements made at low speed are quite different from those at high speed. The moment we try to apply those adaptive movements acquired at one speed to quite another speed, breakdown is swiftly complete.



Chopin's fioriture are invariably one of two kinds: single gesture clusters or compound gesture clusters. The first kind is governed by a single overarching gestural span with all its subsidiary (note) detail encased within, the second can be broken down into any number of smaller gesture arches which then, lego-style, get incorporated into what you could call a 'meta-arch' making up the overall gesture cluster that is meant to be heard seamlessly from the audience's point of view.



One of the biggest and certainly one of the most spectacular single gesture clusters Chopin ever wrote is the 40-element fioritura cluster in the recapitulation to the slow movement of the same concerto you're currently working on. It too must be executed in a single span with all its detail evenly distributed regardless of whatever else is happening at the time. This rule applies to all gesture clusters and their internal detail. There are no compound gesture clusters present in the Chopin concertos' fioriture by my recollection.



With regard to the LH part supporting these moments, its activity needs to be precisely automated and promptly handed off to muscle memory so no involuntary contamination can take place causing time keeping to stray, whatever the performance speed. The RH can then be given all your necessary attention in order to launch and perfectly evenly execute the gesture cluster of the moment at hand. That really is all there is to it.



Not only is slow practice at this end of the repertoire pointless, it's actually counter productive. Adaptive movements acquired at one speed only end up having to be undone entirely when applied to another speed. A perfect waste of effort and actually damaging to the integrity of your memory image, leaving the player a hostage to future breakdowns in that area. Best avoided from the outset.



All the best,



Edit:



@JC: Very well observed and I agree. However, it is the gesture cluster arc that does need to be placed metronomically as regards its beginning and end. What happens *within* the arc can be 'bent' according to the skill of the player in question and requirements of the text/style etc. Technically, I always insist on myself having the capability of metronomically accurate rendering of the content of the gesture cluster, so a precise 19:4, even if for artistic or any other reasons I don't choose to exercise that capability. I was trained that way and happen to agree with it (now). Warmly, as always, *N*

Answer 2

While Nemesis does a quite accurate and compelling justifications for at tempo practice there is also another important issue: what is the performance practice of Chopin.



I'm not aware of any musicologists that suggests 19:4 is meant to be played in a strictly metronomic fashion. Before you get a particular rhythm ingrained in your muscle memory do some study figure out what rhythm you should learn.

Answer 3

+1 to the suggestion of practicing exclusively at performance tempo. Practicing below tempo is really more of a beginner's thing.